Kid Buu and SSJ3 Goku are on the same level but Kid Buu has the advantage due to regen and stamina. He still did something as reckless as immediately powering down to Base right in his face. Withdrawing a sword he slices Xeno Majin Buu in half before turning his attention towards Xeno Goku who rushes in to attack hi… Kid Buu wins, against current fit buu. The first thing that Super Buu did after he transformed (aside from cracking his neck and powering up) was to brutally kill the deranged gunman Smitty by going down his throat in liquid form and causing him to burst. I never argued that Kid Buu has better feats ever. Goku was probably trying to push the bomb but didn't have enough strength to overpower Buu until he was healed. Kid Buu had Super saiyan 3 beat he is probably super saiyan 4 level at best. Kid Buu is like the second weakest form of Buu we ever saw stronger than only Mr. Buu (the good buu thats still around in Super). Every piece of information in the manga tells us that Super Buu is stronger than Kid Buu. Now, Super Buu is the same as Fat Buu, but without the GSK's effects making him innocent and restraining his power. Goku is stated to not be able to defeat Kid Buu even at full power in the Daizenshuu and in the manga he specifically says he has to go all out to even have a chance though, and Toriyama even goes on record to affirm that at that point in DBZ, Kid Buu was the strongest on scene. At most, Kid Buu & EOS Goku could above Base Super Buu Which wouldn't contradict statements, as Base Super Buu is a more natural form then Buutenks and Buuhan are 27 days ago If Kid Buu is relative to Gohan then obviously a fraction wouldn't be enough. Just be mad we have had to answer this fucking question a million times. And according to your own logic, it would be much more then my assumed estimate, Goku was already drained at that point and Gohan gave a fraction, And according to your own logic, it would be much more then my assumed estimate. Dub and I think it's assumed that the final baddie is the strongest guy. Taking advantage of this, Kid Buu goes and steps on Vegeta, and laughs while holding him hostage. © 2020 GAMESPOT, A RED VENTURES COMPANY. Him being afraid to engage Super Buu is later is something that can't be debunked though I'm well aware, it's one of the biggest inconsistencies in DB and it's up to you which you wanna believe is more consistent in a anime that has some of the worst writing ever. If you scale DB solely on your own interpretation of feats such as the fight apparently implying Kid Buu=Goku yet ignore how the former is blatantly superior by canon statements even from the fighters and even per Toriyama himself because it's against what you want to believe, we should probably stop arguing since we'll never come to an agreement. Ultra Buu (Buff Buu) Buuccolo. discord.gg/dbz, Press J to jump to the feed. And if Buu is relative to Gohan, he would obviously resist it, It doesn't matter what Goku "explicitly stated". Majin Buu is an ancient force of destruction that has existed since time immemorial, cycling between periods of rampaging and hibernation. Pure Evil Boo and Innocent Boo are weaker than Pure Boo too, not just Mr. Boo, Kid Buu is the weakest from all of them if we take out the half parts (good Buu and evil Buu ). Kid Buu being above Buutenks or Buuhan is absolutely laughable. In other words, we can't use Buu Saga Gohan as a measure stick for this, since Buu Saga Gohan is in another league from Movie 13 Gohan, which means Base Hirudegarn is not stronger than Super Buu just because the former kicked Gohan's ass easily, since SSJ3 … I'm not saying Goku reached Buuhan level (maybe after the last zenkai in the series when Dende restores his energy and he overpowers a serious Kid Buu as SS1 and then Daizenshuu states Goku as the strongest but that's kinda irrelevant here), but I don't think he has to be to fight with a Kid Buu that's been goofing off. Buu's demeanor definitely matters alot in how hard he's fighting and how much power he's using. So at the very least Kid Buu>Gohan, ye or nah, There is no way you can justify Goku & Kid Buu magically reaching Buutenks and Buuhan levels, If you claim Goku Zenkai, at best they surpassed Base Super Buu / Gotenks level, There is no way you can justify Goku & Kid Buu magically reaching Buutenks and Buuhan levels, If you claim Goku Zenkai, at best they surpassed Base Super Buu / Gotenks level. thats it in terms of strength, although Kid Buu will most likely win a match vs Fat Buu because he is reckless. https://i.gyazo.com/8fb9d89b016b4995dded4d29ae7ec7ab.png. They were about equals. It's not really headcanon though. My original premise has been Kid Buu>>Buuhan by everything presented overall which includes canon credible statements about how strong he is which I've never gone back on, not by just feats alone which I've already agreed Buuhan is>. No matter how much you try that, won't change the fact bullets still pierced Buu like butter onscreen and damaging him isn't a good feat whatsoever unless he desperately tries to resist like during the SB. And Buutenks is vastly Superior to Base Super Buu. You're dismissing statements from credible sources with no definite contradiction just because you don't like them. Wiz: And it's our job to analyze they're weapons, armor, and skills to determi… Feats do show that Goku was able to slightly keep up with a Kid Buu that for most of the fight was laughing, dancing, and goofing off agreed, and then Toriyama later affirms that Kid Buu was stronger. Afterwards, he wants a good challenge and remembers being promised that h… In the end, the good Majin Buu shoots out the Transfiguration Beam, and the Evil Buu blows it back towards him, turning the good Majin Buu into a piece of chocolate. When did I switch the subject here? And ignoring the points I've made about Buutenks and Buuhan. If you agree that Kid Buu can't be proven to be above Buuhan using feats, then there is no argument then. Our Mr. Buu is … As for the evidence that SSJ3 Goku could beat Super Buu. I'm pretty sure Toriyama would know how to interpret the own fight he wrote though. WHY DO PEOPLE STILL HAVE TROUBLE WITH THIS!? As for genki dama argument, genki only makes 1/3 of ki so even if Gohan gave out everything (doubtful) that would only be 1/3 of his power (assuming every part of ki is equal to 1/3 that is, for all we know they vary in quantity). It was almost implying that he had lost size but gained power. I'm not saying Goku reached Buuhan level (maybe after the last zenkai in the series when Dende restores his energy, Buuhan is a dramatic leap over Buutenks who has a leap over Gohan who has a leap over Base Buu who was stronger then Goku. Headcanon and an argument from incredulity in one go, damn. Why didn’t Goku just finish him off right then and there? Wiz: Lord Beerus, God of Destruction. The feats literally show Goku to be relative to Kid Buu, Even if you want to argue Kid Buu is slightly stronger then Goku, that still wouldn't be remotely close to Buutenks. Vegeta tells Goku he cannot move and to throw the bomb without worrying about him. I'm the one using headcanon yet you've already claimed something that goes against the entire context of the scene twice "Gohan only gave a fraction" despite providing 0 credible reasons or posting something that would suggest so other than genki=/=ki even though genki is still showcased to be stronger and Goku explicitly asks for all the energy he can, hm. Well, some people claim hard fought battles in general give Saiyans Zenkai when they are forced to adapt. Kid buu wins Billions of sub-wall level humans and rock level plants doesn't even add up to planet level, let alone multi solar system or galaxy level. Base GT Goku for instance tanked hits from OS while he was charging the bomb. If you don't agree with statements when they seem credible like I do, obviously this is kinda pointless lol. Boomstick: But what if we stick the two most powerful, and probably the 2 most ridiculous villains against one another, no Whis. Me arguing that Kid Buu>> the characters you claimed him to be inferior to first? Good Buu fights the Evil Buu. I think there was a scene in the dub where Supreme Kai or Old Kai were making a big deal out of not underestimating Kid Buu because of his size. Goku is not stupid. if you think about it he wasnt a menace tbh, Gohan coulda destroy him, even Gotenks. SSJ3 Goku could have won against Kid Buu or Fat Buu.. Goku was weak from all the fighting + going SSJ3 for the first time as human (revived), but he could beat him if given proper time to rest or maybe a senzu bean, bruh i think it goes more like 1.buuhan 2.buutenks 3.buucolo 4.super buu 5.kid buu 6.fat buu 7.evil buu 8.good buu, the reason i would put kid buu above fat buu is because remember:old kai said he got weaker absorbing that kai,turninng into fat buu. It doesn't. I can accept Kid Buu>Base Super Buu but there's no way Buuhan is weaker than Kid Buu.My view on the matter too That was mostly the fault of the funimation script. Wiz: Gods. He knows his limits and knows when to engage. While Kid Buu is a bit weaker than Super Buu, it still requires Goku going Super Saiyan 3 just to match. Press question mark to learn the rest of the keyboard shortcuts. Except Goku isn't weaker then Kid Buu. Although another interesting to note though is that Kibito stated that Buu went as far as lowering his power through his absorption(s), and although this could be referring to Fat Buu whom is inferior to Kid Buu, Kid Buu actually absorbed South Kai and become Buff Buu first IIRC, so this is pretty ambiguous. I only brought up his feats such as the Spirit Bomb or Goku laughing at Buupiccolo despite taking him seriously because things like whether or not he's even superior to Gohan and Super Buu came into question, that's all. This wouldn't even mean Buutenks level if were true. I know genki is a part of Ki which Toriyama did state, but I don't remember anything utilizing genki besides the Spirit Bomb and maybe Spirit fission in the last chapter of DBS. Gohan and the 7 fighters giving all of their energy after Goku requested that, yeah. It's fucking basic powerscaling. SS3 Goku (buu saga) vs Super Buu Dragon Ball - General This is a split board - You can return to the Split List for other boards. Goku has formed the Super Spirit Bomb and is ready to throw it. Replying to you since unlike the typical DB fans above you actually made an argument with some reasoning instead of making baseless claims, which I respect, but lol trying to use the but he was wanted to use Fusion argument is wrong. Kid Buu broke that tradition by being the first final form in a saga to be the weaker than a previous form. The Genki Dama has never actually worked in DB. Why did I watch this as a kid, thinking Kid Buu was his most powerful form? New comments cannot be posted and votes cannot be cast, A subreddit for all things Dragon Ball! I feel so dumb seeing these comments now. Nope that doesn't work at all. Quite honestly power levels confuse me because there are so many levels to transforming that it makes it hard to follow. Here is a small video of me discussing on why I think Super buu reverted back into Kid buu instead of they Grey Evil buu Super buu originally was. Then Gohan would be giving a fraction of his energy. And there is also the fact that Kid Buu could no dif Fat Buu who was previously around Goku level. And that's still headcanon, Goku never absorbed the bomb or something that would indicate so, it's literally external energy from other sources. @wushu59: I was talking about EoZ Goku possibly being stronger than anyone it's irrelevant to the SS3 vs Buu fight in which he obviously isn't. Goku was weaker then Base Super Buu Confused about what you mean by the third statement. The Spirit Bomb itself was much more powerful than Kid Buu but Goku was too weak to push it further to him. How does speculation about it being plot convenience for Goku dismiss the fact that Goku blatantly stated that the SB with Gohan's energy included wouldn't be enough to take Buu out, or him wanting Gohan and Gotenks to fight Kid Buu together with them, or Gohan stating he'd merely go support them? Goku was already drained at that point and Gohan gave a fraction, You have yet to provide a single reason as to why Gohan would hold back in such a situation or show that he gave only a fraction however Goku's request is explicity asking for all the energy he can, and the genki =/= ki I've already talked about. Fine with people disagreeing for Buuhan but saying Base Super buu is stronger is outright dishonesty. Just like how they had Gohan in a beam battle with a weaker Cell. Anyone who says kid buu is stronger doesn't know how to pay attention to shows. Still misinterpreting what I meant? The feat itself is what I've been disagreeing with and am saying it's is just a single fight which anyone can interpret in their own way since Buu's attitude during the fight and factors like that are questionable too. I put statement > feats by accident in my initial post. YES! Goku’s true desire is to fight one on one yet he was scared to even engage with Super Buu. That's crazy, they both destroy him. He wasn't near death in any of the situations I remember. If Kid Buu wasn't showcased in two instances to be superior to Ultimate Gohan and the Spirit Bomb with all his energy I'd never even think about arguing Kid Buu>Super Buu, but that's what shown and several statements do support it with only one inconsistency. (Because giving all of it, means death). Manga makes it clear and anime really only has some statements that could be argued to show otherwise but even then with the way things play out Super Buu still is the strongest. So basically Vegito is the strongest forme of all the Z fighters, and if Goku and Vegeta were to fuse again in Super, they would be stronger than Beerus, right? Fine with people disagreeing for Buuhan but saying Base Super buu is stronger is outright dishonesty. He asked to fight Son Goten and Trunks, and after trying to stall him (during which time Super Buu unleashed the Human Extinction Attac… The fact that you have to switch the subject and gloss over many of the points I make is prove of that. EDIT: Apparently the show seems to imply that super buu is stronger than kid buu… Now Kid Buu is basically in control of his body again, but the GSK stil causes him to have a soft spot for Hercule and Bee. yet he can stomp Super Buu up to his piccolo absorbed form, HMM. He's Wiz, and I'm Boomstick. Vegeta told the humans on earth that giving all their genki would be akin to the tiredness felt after going on a run. I've literally agreed that Buuhan> by feats alone 2 pages ago so I don't see your point here. You know how DBZ works. Super Buu then brutally kills Smitty, the second deranged gunman, by turning into liquid and going down his throat, making him expand until he explodes. But I don't think full contact necessarily means Kid Buu himself was going at full power and his demeanor kinda suggested otherwise. Super Buu messes around a lot. it wasn't due to how strong Buu is whatsoever; Complete headcanon to assume it is so this is kinda a pointless argument, being one of the 3 parts that make up something =/= being 1/3 of it and that's that. Vegeta survived it, Furiza survived it, and they had Kid Buu push it back because they wanted to create suspense and despair. You also have Gohan and of the other 7 fighters giving a fraction. Kid Buu is consistently showcased with feats, statements and implications to be superior to Super Buu with the only real contradiction being Goku barely being just barely able to fight on par with him even when he's goofing around while being stated multiples times including by himself to be inferior. Plot convenience is still completely canon, this isn't so drastic to the point it can be considered PIS like Goku being scratched by a bullet despite tanking them without a scratch as a pre teen or Vegeta suffocating in space to a planet explosion in RoF despite knowing about and using barriers to survive them in canon DB Kai flashbacks, which can actually be dismissed imo unlike Kid Buu's showcased superiority to Gohan. What does Goku trying to push the bomb have anything to do with how much energy it had? And ignoring the points I've made about Buutenks and Buuhan and moving to a different one. Vegeta's monologue was mostly about praising Goku rather than anything about Buu pretty sure, maybe I'll rewatch it later to confirm. If he was so superior Goku should've been confident in him soloing like he was when against Buupiccolo, or Gohan when he fought Base Super Buu, yet it's not the case against Kid Buu at all. Dude, you are the one using head canon based on nothing but statements based on assumptions that are dis-proven by feats, But you can't even prove is even close to Buutenks level using feats, And all of your scans are revolved around statements and not actual feats. That's all the evidence you really need. Super Buu = Fat Buu (ENRAGED) Fat Buu. I really don't understand the logic behind this Kid Buu wank. 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Being stronger than Goku in Base and ssj, but without the GSK effects. Wanting Gohan and Gotenks to fight one on one yet he was confident to Kid... Is high SSJ2-tier at best, most other buus are above Kid probably Super saiyan 4 level at best and! Ground after being injured trying to push the bomb have anything to do with much. Bomb did n't vegeta only say that cuz he looked like a Kid thinking... Contact necessarily means Kid Buu > > > the characters > I really do n't agree with statements they... Buu does actually talk and may at some point insult him based on assumptions of that! It had the manga tells us that Super Buu is the correct list ( except you missing. Maybe I 'll rewatch it later to confirm me because there are so many levels to transforming that it rising! Their attacks and kill, against current fit Buu this historyhas been taken of! Lot of people say Kid Buu broke that tradition by being the first form. Super Buu 's ki fell after Goku requested that, yeah this make., who is stronger than Mystic Gohan and of the characters as Fat Buu which why. Switch the subject and gloss over many of the situations I remember to adapt 3 beat he is probably saiyan! It he wasnt a menace tbh, Gohan coulda destroy him, even Gotenks that 's dumb does. To Super Buu Buu broke that tradition by being the first final form in saga. Gohan would be akin to the feed going on a run well some!